Snakes in the news....AGAIN

[acephantom903]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

Since when are they picky eaters?

Gators don't usually pick on anything they think might put up a fight. If they have to fight, they might get injured and they figure it isn't worth it. Most animals will avoid a fight unless it is absolutely necessary. Gators know that they don't need much food to survive. Most adults can get by with 10 pounds of food a year as they don't need to grow any more. They will gladly take more but will usually avoid fighting for it. The only exceptions are when humans feed gators. The gator gets an easy meal and expect all humans to give food so they will behave aggressively to get that food. Something that the few of us posting right now know that other readers might not know is that gators have issues breaking off chunks of food that they cannot outright swallow. Many times if it has recently died and is still fresh, they will drag it to the bottom of the water and pin it under branches to hold it down and wait a few days for it to break down/soften and then they will tear it apart to eat. Gators are highly intelligent creatures which should be respected as the living dinos they are. Gators are not crocodiles which are better suited for hunting larger prey.

[Noelle7206]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

.... They wouldn't view it as food if it were alive....

I think they would, if the gator had the size advantage, & I'm not at all sure they'd be any more logical than snakes are when it comes to size, but I've never lived with any gators.
Since when are they picky eaters? But anyway, non-native pythons still don't belong in FL, whether or not they get eaten or eat others.

[Pandorasdad]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

An adult gator couldn't take a six foot Burmese?

Maybe a very large one. But burms are more of a danger to the alligators than the other way around. Gators grow slow. A juvenile gator is definitely on a big burm's menu.

[acephantom903]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

An adult gator couldn't take a six foot Burmese?

Could they kill one? yes. They wouldn't view it as food if it were alive. Gators are not predators to large medium size animals or large animals. Gators prey on small animals and fish and birds and will eat anything which is dead. They keep the swamps clean of dead creatures.

[bcr_229]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

I'd say any burmese over 6 foot is out of local predator range as they are heavier than most snakes in florida.

An adult gator couldn't take a six foot Burmese?

[acephantom903]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

Once that snake reached 10 feet or so, there's literally nothing in S. Florida that can take one down, except us

I'd say any burmese over 6 foot is out of local predator range as they are heavier than most snakes in florida. There haven't been many found over 10 feet in the everglades. Average "adult" size found is 7.7'. Largest was 17.3' if I recall correctly which sounds suspiciously large but possible. Largest recently confirmed was at the last python challenge at 15.5'(?) which was a big girl and more believable since it isn't at the edge of a world record.

[Noelle7206]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

True. But the native wildlife did not evolve along with the pythons. They have no defense against them when they grow. Once that snake reached 10 feet or so, there's literally nothing in S. Florida that can take one down, except us. Sure, only one in 100 babies born survives to adulthood. But that's still one more python that doesn't belong there.

And not only that but the abnormal abundance of small pythons as a food source for certain predators of small snakes then may put those predators out of balance as well. Ecosystems are delicately interwoven
species....when you add or subtract just one, the effects may be much wider than you'd expect, & literally devastating in the long run. It's very hard to predict, but by now we know that (historically) when animals
have been released with a specific goal in mind, the effect NEVER stops there, and the consequence is usually more negative than positive. "Oops!"

That's why we now have regulations against the release of non-native species...we've learned the hard way. Sadly, when it comes to cats running loose everywhere, most people have a blind-spot that originated
many years ago when many more of us lived in rural areas and used cats to keep barns & grain storage on our farms free of rodents. (while ignoring nature that provided snakes for that purpose-) Our society hasn't
yet caught up with how much our country has changed, nor gotten over it's irrational hysteria over snakes, no matter if harmless & venomous, and most people STILL refuse to acknowledge that their pet cats do
NOT belong roaming outside.

[Pandorasdad]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

Another thing is that the pythons add to the food chain as baby pythons are food for everything which eats snakes in south florida. Adult pythons which are rare to find are not food for anything except when dead.

True. But the native wildlife did not evolve along with the pythons. They have no defense against them when they grow. Once that snake reached 10 feet or so, there's literally nothing in S. Florida that can take one down, except us. Sure, only one in 100 babies born survives to adulthood. But that's still one more python that doesn't belong there.

[acephantom903]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

Another thing is that the pythons add to the food chain as baby pythons are food for everything which eats snakes in south florida. Adult pythons which are rare to find are not food for anything except when dead.

[Pandorasdad]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

to all roaming cats, whether 'pets' or feral

Yup. Cats are, BY FAR more destructive as feral pests than snakes. Not as destructive as mice/rats, but right up there. Which is a little ironic.

[Noelle7206]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

Yes. And house cats should remain house cats. Outdoor house cats can kill up to 10 native animals a week for fun. We only get to see the ones they bring home.

When they've put mini-cams on pet cats that went out to roam, they were quite surprised at the destruction...I think 10 per week is a very low estimate anyway, based on the research I've read & watched, plus
it depends on whether the cat is fed "at home" or actually hunting for food. "Pets" just maim or kill & leave, while the ferals kill & eat. It's true that only a fraction of their killing is brought home for 'show'...but
that sure doesn't change the destruction, it just makes their owners less willing to take responsibility.

Wildlife already has more than enough to contend with, including natural predators, habitat loss and toxic pollution, poaching, climate change etc, without having to survive the ever-increasing onslaught of loose
domestic cats. We need to pressure our local animal control personnel & community leaders including health departments and Game & Fish...emphasize the health hazards* to humans spread by cats. Doesn't hurt
to search, print out & have on hand some of the articles in print about this, otherwise they take the easy road & try to keep looking the other way, since they are afraid to offend the many people who keep cats
& allow roaming.

[acephantom903]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

I love pets of all kinds...but they belong in homes, never roaming. Cats are charming pets, when KEPT as pets

Yes. And house cats should remain house cats. Outdoor house cats can kill up to 10 native animals a week for fun. We only get to see the ones they bring home.

[Noelle7206]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

With invasive species of any kind, it's not just about what they eat (& hooray for all the pythons eating cats in Florida! LOL) but it's also that they COMPETE with native wildlife for food and space.

They can also carry diseases to which native wildlife has no previous contact with & therefore they have no resistance. Cats have the added "bonus" of spreading not only fleas & parasites but also all
sorts of diseases that may sicken humans too, including rabies, toxoplasmosis & cryptosporidiosis, unlike the irrationally-hated snakes. In short, all invasive species make a mess out of our natural world.

And to be clear, I love pets of all kinds...but they belong in homes, never roaming. Cats are charming pets, when KEPT as pets. Loose, they are subject to injury, poison, predators, diseases & people
who are totally sick of them, besides harming our wildlife, so why would anyone who "cares about their pet" let them roam?

[acephantom903]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

The pythons shouldn't be there. I have zero problem with them being eradicated to the extent that it is possible.

No, I mean that they feel the snakes are sacred so they will still kill them but refuse to allow researchers to observe them. If they are sacred, wouldn't that mean they would allow observation but no extermination? The way they are now doing it is the second worst way to go about it. Worst way would be to stop all observation and removal.

I don't care about the pythons as much as other introduced species. The pythons can eat adult prey which is harmful but they cannot eat very often nor are they able to find food regularly. Tegu on the other hand will wipe out an entire nest of eggs once a week and they are good at finding the nests. Feral cats (only near people but people are everywhere) also do significant damage to migratory bird and small bird populations. Tegus and feral cats have been known to prey on endangered bird and rats and other small mammals where so far the pythons are only confirmed on eating invasive rats, non-threatened wading birds, small to medium sized mammals, young deer, small to medium sized reptiles, and a couple instances of endangered rat or endangered rabbit. It is possible that they might eat more endangered wildlife but it hasn't been confirmed -- we need more research which is not being allowed any more for a bizarre reason on that one reserve of 83,200 acres.

[Noelle7206]

Re: Snakes in the news....AGAIN

No. The pythons shouldn't be there. I have zero problem with them being eradicated to the extent that it is possible.

I agree. We need to protect our native wildlife & their ecosystems from invasive species. Which should apply equally, by the way, to all roaming cats, whether 'pets' or feral, as they
kill billions of birds, reptiles & mammals every year. It's unacceptable...there are no other domestic animals allowed to roam, pollute & do as they please while trespassing...it's time
we speak up & put a stop to it instead of looking the other way. And cat feces carry very real health risks to humans as well as our other pets (-that actually BELONG in our yards).

Back to non-native snakes on the loose, it's never ok. Same as cats, we can't have it both ways.